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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Does anyone else debate building a "super street" R3 vs. just upgrading to 6XX?

Howdy all!

I've had my R3 for almost a year and it has several thousand miles on it. I like it. I like it a lot! I love the light weight and the instantly flickable nature the bike has. I really enjoy the gas mileage at 47 mpg even with my winding it out all the time. Relative to larger displacement bikes the parts are cheaper and just now the secondary market is really starting to kick in. It's a terrific commuter, which let's face it, if you're not in Cali or another country you end up sitting quite a bit if you come and go during "normal" working hours. Although it's a totally different thing, if I ever get the time and money to get to the track the R3 appears to make a competent tracker and costs a lot less to operate in that environment when compared to its bigger brothers. All and all, the R3 is just really easy to live with.

However.... I'm a stout dude, I've lost 25 pounds since I got the bike and I've got a lot more to lose from my current 259, but I'm lifting again so me in pretty good shape is still 200-210. 42 horsepower can only move 200+ pounds of guy plus gear so fast. Pegs and bar.... Hmmm.... I know this is a much debated subject, so I'll start with the easy part. I'm 5' 9" so with the stock height pegs I can't even get my knees into the tank cut outs. Several times I've come really close to buying the foot peg adapters from Jesse (his levers have been awesome BTW), but I'm stopped by this vary debate about spending more money on the R3 or trading "up." I've also given lots of thoughts to Vortex bars. I didn't think I wanted to have an aggressive seating position after a 20 year layoff, but after getting back into the swing of things I've realized I don't want Moto3 full on race bike aggressive for everyday riding, but I could do with a little more lean. I've already added heavier front springs to assist with my girth, but I could sure get behind an Ohlins shock and some Andreani fork cartridges as well (maybe overkill for the street, but I for sure need to do something about the rear shock at my size).

Obviously practically any 6XX supersport bike would fix the ergonomics issues for me. Power would be the same kind of thing. I know that the ownership costs would go up, but something 6XX would split the difference between the R3 and a liter bike. I have also given consideration to a naked like the FZ 07. I realize the overall power would be down from a supersport, but for daily riding I think it could be more usable power. I could throw on some foot peg adapters and more aggressive bars and have a good ergo situation on a great "do it all" bike.

I ride as many days as humanly possible, aside from the worst of weather. I live in the greater Cincinnati area so I've already been riding in the 20's this winter. I've treated the R3 pretty much like a car just riding it to work in the rain during the warmer months. My commute is about 20 minutes of stop and go driving on city streets and I'm always wearing a backpack with my work shoes, lunch and rain gear in it. Tragically I've only averaged about one twisty ride per month since I got it. The roads near me are just too darn straight for fun. Ugh!

Sadly, I can only afford one bike right now. My R3 is a Raven 2015, one owner, clean title, that's never been down, with a little over 2,000 miles on it. I'm trying to be realistic and think I could sell/trade it for $3,500-3,800. I could then put another $3-4,000 of cash in on the deal. I think this would get my into a five-ish year old supersport 6XX territory or I could set my sights on a new FZ 07 with that kind of money I suppose.

I road carbed 250's in the 90's and as many of us know the R3 is light years beyond those bikes. I really enjoy the bikes low weight, ease of ownership and low cost factor. However, I just can't decide of I want to go all in and have a "super street" styled R3 or skip adding things a piece at a time and jump back into bigger bikes. I have nothing against either size as I owned a Katana 600 that was loads of fun many years ago.

If anyone has any personal experience in this matter or constructive advice I would love to hear your thoughts below!

Thanks!

Giff
 

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Hello Giff,

I weigh about 200-205, with gear im probably at about 215sh. Is the bike fun? **** yea, im almost at 10k miles. Does it get old? Eh, sort of, depends on what you mean by "old". My problem is that ive been riding my dads 1200s ducatii multistrada and it absolutely ruined my bike for me rofl. For people our size we need atleast a 600 to really push our body at the speeds that motorcycles should be going. Just sell the bike when you feel the time is right, get the most money and buy a used 600. Theres even companies that help finance a used bike at 2-3% APR. The R3 is truley a great bike, but when you want to go faster then cars on the highway its really not gonna work. I had a guy walk me in his 5.0 mustang, i couldnt keep up past 60 mph. However the other weekend i had the 1200 ducati out and a hopped up camaro tried to race me and i walked him so bad. I actually felt bad for his girlfriend because i put him to shame after 30 mph. I was probably doing over 100 by the time he hit 60. I slowed down and he gave me the thumbs up and then i wheelied off. The R3 can not and will not do anything a bigger bike can, and that is why it is lacking. In hindsight i paid too much for this bike for what its worth to me and i think the same for you. However it is a minimal investment compared to other vehicles (only 5k). Seriously just sell the bike, get ur funds back, and get a 600. You can ride a 600 like a grandma all day and when you need the power to ruin those muscle car/ricers you can do it with ease. Well some muscle cars your gonna need a 750 or 1000 but w.e dont get too crazy lol.
 

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I fel you, at 5'9" 189lbs, the R3 would be perfect with 50+ hp, but even with my full exhaust,BMC filter and a Bazzazz fi, the bike's power just feels lacking compared to old GSX600(2001). I'm also getting the itch for a slightly used 600, just looking on ebay and local CL I have found that if you can up the budget to $8000, there are lots of quality used 600's and the occasional GSXR 750.

This may be a "hot take" on a Yamaha forum, but the best used 600...CBR600rr.

Cue the "Bruh, you don't know sh**" in 1...2...3..
 

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I fel you, at 5'9" 189lbs, the R3 would be perfect with 50+ hp, but even with my full exhaust,BMC filter and a Bazzazz fi, the bike's power just feels lacking compared to old GSX600(2001). I'm also getting the itch for a slightly used 600, just looking on ebay and local CL I have found that if you can up the budget to $8000, there are lots of quality used 600's and the occasional GSXR 750.

This may be a "hot take" on a Yamaha forum, but the best used 600...CBR600rr.

Cue the "Bruh, you don't know sh**" in 1...2...3..
BRO YOU DONT KNO SHEEEEEEIT

jk lol, a used quality gsxr 750 is like 8k max. 600 are even cheaper. I actually almost bought a 2008 gsxr600 with 3.8k miles on it for 4500. But i passed because i dont need a new bike atm and i sorta want newer technology. What i want to know is why you thought adding a new exhaust/bazzaz fi would make your bike so much faster. On cars its different because your working with hundreds of horsepower so your ratios of increased performance are waaaay more noticeable, but on these little bikes 10-15% gain on 40 horse is nothing really noticeable.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I fel you, at 5'9" 189lbs, the R3 would be perfect with 50+ hp, but even with my full exhaust,BMC filter and a Bazzazz fi, the bike's power just feels lacking compared to old GSX600(2001). I'm also getting the itch for a slightly used 600, just looking on ebay and local CL I have found that if you can up the budget to $8000, there are lots of quality used 600's and the occasional GSXR 750.

This may be a "hot take" on a Yamaha forum, but the best used 600...CBR600rr.

Cue the "Bruh, you don't know sh**" in 1...2...3..
Man you nailed it with the 50 horsepower! I so wanted this bike to be like a Honda CB-1 400cc from 1990. 55 horsepower on a sub 400 pound bike. I rode one once, it was a great mix of just enough power to be fun, but so light weight that you could flick it around just like the R3.
 

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I feel your quandry, and everyone has excellent points. Before buying, I had similar sentiments, and even know, a year in, wonder about the future. I'm 5'5" with an athletic/stocky build at 165 lbs. The R3 is comfy for my but I have Tyga rearsets so myfoot pegs are higher up and back. Except for my first bike, a Honda VTR Interceptor 250, I've rode 600's my whole life. I never got into the "CC" wars and even with a 600, I had Busa and Zx-14R dudes telling me a 600 was too small and not powerful enough. Whatever. To me the 600 is THE sweet spot-good power, nimble, not as rough on insurance, etc. My last bike for the past 10 years before 2016 was an 03 Honda CBR600RR. I wanted something less aggressive, and more practical. Fortunately, lightweights, adventure bikes, etc have expanded their categories where the lines are blurred and there are more types and specialized categories of motorcycle than ever before. So I was torn between the Ninja 300, KTM 390, and R3. Since purchasing, I have gone pretty nuts with parts and wanted to really make it my own, but also more powerful (as can be), better breaking, better ride, etc. Despite all the upgrades I kept the stock clip-ons because I like the position! So it's near the price of a stock R6 almost. I love the R3, and it is a great commuter, weekend canyon carver, etc. It is totally practical. Ideally, we'd all have 3-4 bikes, but not all of us can afford an R3 with a Ducati Supersport, Triumph Scrambler, and a Yamaha Versys in the garage as well. You do pine for the acceleration and power of a 600. So it makes you wonder if you'd just be better off with a 600. It's a tough choice. I'm committed at this point. So I get your dilemma.

Personally, I decided I would have the R3 at least a few years-I wouldn't do anything rash. I have spent a fair amount on it as far as parts. You certainly increase the overall value, but you certainly won't get any ROI on it. On the flip side, problem is right now, with all the different models out there, I don't think there is a perfect 500-600 that is like a 600cc version of an R3, if you will. The R6 and Zx-6R are my two favorite 600 Supersports with the CBR600RR and Gixxer600 close behnd. The two former just have better specs and modern tech the other two don't. I still love the Yamaha FZ600R (and I will always try to go Yamaha or Honda if I can because that is what I prefer), but it is dated. It's the closest thing to an R3 with a 600 engine. Standard riding position with Inline-4 600 power. It's swingarm is still a hollow rectangular steel tube, and has no modern electronic rider aids like traction control or ABS ( but nor did the R3 until 2017). I'm actually fine without them, but on my next bike I think I want ABS and TC. The Honda CB650F is kind of flawed, but compelling; apparently its clunky and a little groggy in the power curve. I love the Daytona 675 R but that is beaucoup loot and very aggressive too. The whole point it seem to your situation is wanting something where you're sitting upright and comfortable, it has excellent control and maneuverability, and has ample power, and is budget friendly regarding total cost of ownership. The Kawasaki Ninja 650 is very compelling. It's a 650, has ABS, has a "standard" riding position, and is a Parallel Twin, so has plenty of giddy up at the low to middle ends, but not the top end power of an Inline-4. So I'd say, you can invest wisely in the R3 and upgrade it to your liking. By wisely I mean, for example, instead of getting $500 Sato Racing rear sets, you get Yamaha R3 Racing rear set risers for a fraction of the price, etc. You can certainly upgrade it without breaking the bank. Also, the R3 has been out long enough, that you can probably fine a lot of expensive upgrades sold used at a discount-used full exhaust, used Ohlins rear shock, etc. If you want to stay within the Supersport to Sport segment, I think the two most compelling choices to upgrade to are the Yamaha FZ600R and Kawasaki Ninja 650. The Honda CBR500R (and F series) is a nice bike too, but not that big of a jump over the R3 or other 300's as they're both P-Twin 500's. The Ninja 650 got a nice overhaul for 2017.

It would be awesome to have 3-4 bikes. Ideally, maybe I'll keep the R3 and get a second bike in the future. Hopefully some of my ideas helped. You could certainly upgrade a few things and give the R3 a chance over a longer time horizon and decide later. Otherwise, it seems you have a few other choices, but nothing that is totally perfect in my estimation. The best solution is having multiple bikes, but obviously that isn't feasible. At any rate, hope you are happy with your choice, and you let everyone know where you land on this. Good luck!
 

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I've put a fair bit of money into my "street" r3 and will continue to do so because it is the right bike for me, right now. In another year or two the right bike will likely be something different.

Go and test ride multiple bikes in the spring demo days. Almost every manufacturer will have them starting up in April or may. They are short rides, but you'll know immediately if you want more power or a different riding position. Try everything, cruisers, Supersport, adventure bikes. You might be surprised at what traits in a bike stand out to you.

Until you can say I definitely want a bike more capable of "xxxxxx", I wouldn't sell the one you have. The resale value of the 3 will be reasonably high, and a few grand on top of it will get you into a lot of nice, used bikes. You have a lot of options, no need to rush it
 

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BRO YOU DONT KNO SHEEEEEEIT

jk lol, a used quality gsxr 750 is like 8k max. 600 are even cheaper. I actually almost bought a 2008 gsxr600 with 3.8k miles on it for 4500. But i passed because i dont need a new bike atm and i sorta want newer technology. What i want to know is why you thought adding a new exhaust/bazzaz fi would make your bike so much faster. On cars its different because your working with hundreds of horsepower so your ratios of increased performance are waaaay more noticeable, but on these little bikes 10-15% gain on 40 horse is nothing really noticeable.
1) here in AZ and SoCal, there is no Winter, so bikes sell well all year, any GSXR750 under $7k, I would be weary of (but I may be wrong)

2) I'm well aware of the limits of hp gains on our bikes, but the girlfriend bought me the Yosh full exhaust as a gift, so the BMC and Bazzazz was a no brainer. Little more power, 11lbs off the bike and she finally sounds like a real bike. Plus the bike was also a gift from Mom(best Mom ever), so a few bucks for a few (and I do mean a few) extra ponies fine with me.
 

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After 25 years of ridding motorcycles, the R3 is the best bike I have ever owned.

In the last 18 months since buying the R3 I have had not had any speeding tickets or been charged with dangerous operation of a motor vehicle.

The low cost of ownership summary.

1. Great fuel economy (bike has no power)
2. Tires and brakes never wear out. (no power)
3. Cheap insurance. (no power)
4. Don't need lawyers to represent me. (no power)

With my early onset Parkinson's caused by chronic ice and oxy abuse the yamaha R3 with ABS has been the perfect fit.
Next year I'm considering the Piaggio MP3 250 because it has 3 wheels and even less power.

Seriously, why do noob ridders always want to hugely modify nice entry level bikes? Maybe they should spend more time on learning to corner and brake.
Anyone can go fast in a straight line and get arrested.
 

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Since you are a big guy, and you use your motorcycle for commuting, I think you would like the FZ-07.
It has more power. It's comfortable and sporty. You can probably find a good deal on a last-year leftover.
I almost bought a 2016 FZ-07. But I decided on the R3 instead, because I already had a CBR1000RR.
I didn't need the extra power of the FZ, and the R3 was quite a bit cheaper. I only weigh 160lbs, so the R3 is fine for me.
 

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The R3 is my first bike ever. I've ridden a Ninja 250 and the CBR 125 (obviously no comparison) but that's the extent of my experience. I'm only 5'6" and 155 lbs. so the power on the R3 is just right for me. I sat on some 600's and found the tank to be too wide and the riding position too aggressive for my taste but as I said, this is my first bike ever.

I think it comes down to what you want and what your objective is - do you want to just get on it and boot around or do you want to go faster all the time? I know one of the guys here who runs yamahar3racing.com (Jesse), he started on the bigger bikes but found he likes the R3 better in many ways because of its lightweight. I think he says something along those lines on his website.

The only thing I like more about the bigger bikes for sure is the sound. OMG, its soo fricken awesome to hear a 600 roar by you, the twin just doesn't compare in my opinion.
 

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The only thing I like more about the bigger bikes for sure is the sound. OMG, its soo fricken awesome to hear a 600 roar by you, the twin just doesn't compare in my opinion.
Nothing compares to the sound of an Aprilia RSV4 with a GP-style exhaust muffler. ( Austin Racing / SC Project )
:D
 

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After 25 years of ridding motorcycles, the R3 is the best bike I have ever owned.

In the last 18 months since buying the R3 I have had not had any speeding tickets or been charged with dangerous operation of a motor vehicle.

The low cost of ownership summary.

1. Great fuel economy (bike has no power)
2. Tires and brakes never wear out. (no power)
3. Cheap insurance. (no power)
4. Don't need lawyers to represent me. (no power)

With my early onset Parkinson's caused by chronic ice and oxy abuse the yamaha R3 with ABS has been the perfect fit.
Next year I'm considering the Piaggio MP3 250 because it has 3 wheels and even less power.

Seriously, why do noob ridders always want to hugely modify nice entry level bikes? Maybe they should spend more time on learning to corner and brake.
Anyone can go fast in a straight line and get arrested.
Nothing wrong with spending money on a bike weather its entry level or not. I like doing track days to learn cornering technique and just having a good time while avoiding costly tickets in an unsafe environment (street). I like spending money on my entry level bike as much as any other bike I have owned, entry level or not. I can easily see spending over $2000 on an R3. That would be no different than if I owned my zx6r still, or any of my 650's, Etc. Some people just like kidding what they own.
 

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I used to debate on trading in the R3 and upgrading, but I ownership costs is so cheap, I think I can have both the R3 and a 600 in my stable.

The plan is to track and commute with the R3, while 600 would get some weekend run. Modifications would probably be some nice brake pads and sticky tires for the track.

After demo riding a few 600s, and also riding my bud's 07' CBR600RR in Vegas for hours on end.. I just can't stick with the R3 as a lone wolf. And not gonna lie, I like messing around on the freeway lol, the R3 just doesn't give me that 'feel.' Yes yes, turns and all is where it's at.. but sometimes I like a good pull on the wide open freeway.

And as mentioned above by BlueBirdR3, I like the sound of bigger bikes too. My bud's 600RR had a Yoshi exhaust on it, and man it sounded so good. R3, IMO, with an aftermarket exhaust system..still sounds like a lawnmower. :x
 

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I used to debate on trading in the R3 and upgrading, but I ownership costs is so cheap, I think I can have both the R3 and a 600 in my stable.


That's how the collection starts. Be careful, it can get expensive I have 5 bikes and always looking at increasing my collection
 

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That's how the collection starts. Be careful, it can get expensive I have 5 bikes and always looking at increasing my collection
Hahaha, it may go that way. Figured if I go past 2 bikes, I'm going to have to look into storage space. Only time will tell. :D
 
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